[Closed] Borg Warner Efr Series Turbos

[Lithium]

Seems the EFR turbos don't need E85 to make good numbers - another Kiwi lad had his RB30DET R32 GTR tuned running a .92a/r twin scroll EFR8374 today on BP Ultimate, 462kw @ hubs on 20psi... full boost by 3300rpm.

And a dyno plot- they dialled back the tune/boost curve a bit because they were running into issues with boost control with the internal wastegate, they will go back on the dyno when they think they've got that sorted... but for now, this is how the numbers look:

[bradsm87]

The password has finally been lifted on the Perrin blog's review of the 7163. Looks impressive:

http://blog.perrinpe...-test-and-tune/

I hope it comes out in twin scroll. I hope EVEN MORE that they bring out a smaller twin scroll than the T4 .92 for all B1 frame turbo's. Something like a divided T3 .82 would be ideal.

Edited June 23, 2012 by bradsm87

[GTScotT]

Someone should download that perrin site before they take it down. very informative, very cool.

for sure the 7163 is the pick of the bunch for the lower power bracket..

but i was a little heart broken when they overlayed the 3076R against it, sure the boost stood up earlier but the difference in power and torque wasnt amazing. disappointed there

[R31Nismoid]

I think I'm more shocked that the GTX3076, at 1.7bar only made 30rwhp more than a GT3076

Also are the EFR's using twin scroll over the GT's being single? Can't see it referenced anywhere (or the fuel)

[bradsm87]

The EFR is a T2 flanged single scroll .64.

[wolverine]

I think I'm more shocked that the GTX3076, at 1.7bar only made 30rwhp more than a GT3076

Also are the EFR's using twin scroll over the GT's being single? Can't see it referenced anywhere (or the fuel)

0.63 (GT)vs 0.82 (GTX) turbine housings as well so not apples for apples but still not impressive.

[GTScotT]

the GTX .82 should have helped top end power over the GT's .63 if anything.

agree that was also a disappointing discovery. I wonder what would happen if Mick put a garden variety GT3071 in his and back to backed it at unigroup... now that would be interesting. weve been saying the GTX3071 seems to be the pick of the bunch, but i dont know of any well setup eflex tuned 3071s (on an RB25) to compare it to... so hmm.

[wolverine]

Both Mick and I had our cars on the same dyno around the same time and my GT3076 was the better thing on 98ron.

With E85 his car blew past mine but I still believe he would have a fatter midrange with the GT3076.

Ultimately his car is the by far and away the best R33 I have driven once he went to pineapple juice but I was slightly disappointed with the GTX3071 on pump.

[Lithium]

I forget, have you - or are you going to try funkyfuel??

[wolverine]

It's about 30 mins to the nearest E85 plus I would be on the edge with 550cc injectors and a PFC.

To make it worthwhile I would go the Link/ViPex, ethanol sensor and some bigger injectors but that is money better spent on 98ron.

[GTScotT]

Both Mick and I had our cars on the same dyno around the same time and my GT3076 was the better thing on 98ron.

With E85 his car blew past mine but I still believe he would have a fatter midrange with the GT3076.

Ultimately his car is the by far and away the best R33 I have driven once he went to pineapple juice but I was slightly disappointed with the GTX3071 on pump.

correct me if Im wrong but your running a HKS lowmount T3 split pulse manifold with a T3 split pulse housing?

Micks is the OEM manifold with a .83 T3 open internal gate, which would make it a very difficult comparison to make IMO

[wolverine]

It isn't apples for apples but I had the GT3040 (open) on there before so my bum dyno isn't too bad.

IMO the TS and smaller compressor wasn't worth the extra cash over the old turbo setup.

Sorry back to BW.

[GTScotT]

Valuable info for any reader, normally when doing turbo selection reading i read all threads to get as much as I can. So the GT info isnt necessarily out of place here anyway.

Glad you made the comment re value between 3040 open and 3076 split.

[Dajae]

Anyone heard if BW have their supply issues sorted out yet? I know from reading the suby forums back in April they were still having issues..

Im looking into either the new-ish 7163, or one of the medium frame brothers. I think (especially) the 7163 in IWG on a TS mani will be good for a "street" turbo.

its just the possible wait that is a little depressing

[SimonR32]

7163 could be a winner with a T3 0.8ish rear on a RB25. I wonder how much they would max out on power though

[GTScotT]

About the same as a 3076 it seems, there was decent testing done by perrin.

Boost response seemed a lot better on the EFR but power only stood up marginally earlier (weird). I would say that has to do with the motors ability to ingest the volume at that RPM. So a breathier motor potentially could get more out of it.

[Old Booster]

Any of these FSRs suitable for a RB20 on stock ex manifold? looking for response not max power.

Edited June 25, 2012 by Old Booster

[SimonR32]

About the same as a 3076 it seems, there was decent testing done by perrin.

Boost response seemed a lot better on the EFR but power only stood up marginally earlier (weird). I would say that has to do with the motors ability to ingest the volume at that RPM. So a breathier motor potentially could get more out of it.

It is making 50-75hp more between 2500-3500 and peak torque about 500rpm earlier... Wouldn't make much difference on a track/drift/drag car but on the road it's a lot

[GTScotT]

True that it is a decent number of difference between them at those points, but the character of the unit is more or less the same.

The threshold is at roughly the same point which indicates to me that during full pelt driving they would feel roughly the same. You could say the difference could be less than whats expected between thrashing the car during the day or on a cold night.

[Lithium]

True that it is a decent number of difference between them at those points, but the character of the unit is more or less the same.

The threshold is at roughly the same point which indicates to me that during full pelt driving they would feel roughly the same. You could say the difference could be less than whats expected between thrashing the car during the day or on a cold night.

OK, two things come to mind here -

1/ Its VERY consistantly reported that EFRs are very very responsive, a boost curve on a dyno plot does not show how a car drives at all - it just gives a general idea of things. We've talked at length about this, the responsiveness of EFR turbos do sometimes get sold short of their real world performance on dyno comparisons because of this fact

2/ On top of the above, you seriously call this a comparison an equivalent boost threshold??

Considering how much you backed things like 52trim GT3076R/GT3071R/GT2835/whatever when comparing with a 56trim GT3076R which in comparison immeasurably less lag - you make no sense.