Jump to content
SAU Community

Recommended Posts

12 hours ago, admS15 said:

Just about ready for a track day again but for some reason the driver can't find any motivation. 

Watch Drive to Survive on Netflix, somehow that gets me motivated to race lol..

  • Haha 2

I think my lack of motivation partly comes from being lazy and CBF prepping properly and putting the effort in for a track day. As you guys know, you get out about as much as you put in. If I go, I don't want to be half arsed.

Will also need new semis, reinstall cage, race seat, track pads and maybe replace rotors too. I'm tired just thinking about it, lol. 

The other part that worries me, is the possibility of killing the engine. It's not getting any younger and it's done quite a bit of track duties over the years. $800 dollar RB's are ancient history. I guess if it happens, 7-10K will hopefully get me a refreshed forged bottom end. Oh well, suppose I'll just have to YOLO it.

  • Like 1
44 minutes ago, admS15 said:

Good point but where's the fun in that, lol.

Out of curiosity, do you remember what the bearings in your first motor looked liked when it let go? 

I never bothered take off to check, I saw damage on the head, block scoring and just launched the motor.

The cam caps were scored though, looked like metal bits went through the motor, when I drained the oil it looked like glitter lol.

On 22/03/2023 at 10:40 PM, Dose Pipe Sutututu said:

I never bothered take off to check, I saw damage on the head, block scoring and just launched the motor.

The cam caps were scored though, looked like metal bits went through the motor, when I drained the oil it looked like glitter lol.

Fair enough, if I saw that I wouldn't of went any further either. 

That's fair, lots of work to track prep it, risk of breaking it, all time and money and you're covering both of those so it's easy for us to sit back and say go for it son! 

If you do go, knowing the engine is older, just be kinder to it I guess. Nice gradual warm up, 1 hot lap maybe 2 max, cool down lap etc. Just give the engine a chance to manage thermal loads and oil return to the sump. 


 

  • Like 1
1 hour ago, ActionDan said:

If you do go, knowing the engine is older, just be kinder to it I guess. Nice gradual warm up, 1 hot lap maybe 2 max, cool down lap etc. Just give the engine a chance to manage thermal loads and oil return to the sump.

Maybe a stupid question, but do people stick to just 3-4 laps like that in a session or repeat it? For example in a 15 minute session there would be time for more than 3-4 laps.

Do you then do something like

warmup, hot lap, cool down lap, hot lap, cool down lap and so on?

  • Like 1
59 minutes ago, soviet_merlin said:

Maybe a stupid question, but do people stick to just 3-4 laps like that in a session or repeat it? For example in a 15 minute session there would be time for more than 3-4 laps.

Do you then do something like

warmup, hot lap, cool down lap, hot lap, cool down lap and so on?

Since you'll be heading out to All Shit Box Day, I mean All Jap Day and doing the sprint sessions I suggest this during the 15 minute window

  • Come onto the track, use this time to reacquaint yourself with the lap, then on the T17 start to push
  • Do 2x hot laps
  • 1x cool down
  • 1x hot lap
  • 1x cool down
  • Session over

 

  • Thanks 1

I'm with Johnny and yes I used to do that process often because my tyres could not handle more than 2hot laps to start then 1 ever other lap because I drive like shit and I am brutal on the gear. 

As I was nearing the end of my last season and worrying about the stock CA surviving so I could win my class I was also dropping max RPM, down to like 6500 and only doing sometimes 2 hot laps in a session as the season old tyres were giving up, and yet I kept going faster every track day so you don't gotta rev/drive/turn in hard to set a good time. 

Especially when you're as average a driver as all of us will be. 

  • Like 3

With reasonable brakes, tyres and cooling, you should be able to go 100% for a 20minute session (well, 1 warm up lap first)

Just watch out for any of them having an issue:

-Coolant temp gauge and oil temp/oil pressure

-Tyres loosing grip - increased understeer in long corners right hand (clockwise track) or left hand (anti clockwise track) 

-Brakes - oh shit moment when you press them, or sometimes there is a warning via smell or longer pedal first

  • Like 2

I've only had limited experience with budget R comps/good street tyres (NankangAR1/Federal RSR etc) but neither would come close to a full 20min session at the level of push required to get a PB for my car i.e. 100%

Maybe bigger dollar tyres will give better consistency, but I can't think of many affordable tyres that are going to give top tier PB level grip for 20mins of 100% push unless your car is heavily over tyred for the power/suspension capability etc. 

I would go as far as to say if your tyres can last that long you are not driving anywhere near as hard as the car can handle. 

Time attack is called 1 perfect lap for a reason. 



 

  • Like 2
15 minutes ago, Duncan said:

With reasonable brakes, tyres and cooling, you should be able to go 100% for a 20minute session

"Reasonable brakes, tyres and cooling" to this extent REQUIRES:

Brakes: Race pads/upgraded/full BBK.
Tyres: R Comps, the best street tyres will be screaming for mercy before this on a track with many bends.
Cooling: 25+ row oil cooler, a radiator sent from the gods/ducting.
Bonus: Accusump

Without any of these the car will very much be a 1-2 laps (at most) before your oil is 150C+, brakes die, engine overheats. There is a reason:
 

Quote

Come onto the track, use this time to reacquaint yourself with the lap, then on the T17 start to push

  • Do 2x hot laps
  • 1x cool down
  • 1x hot lap
  • 1x cool down
  • Session over


Is a thing.

It takes LOT$ of "Reasonable brakes, tyres, and cooling" to do 30 minute flat out session all day.

  • Like 3
1 hour ago, soviet_merlin said:

Maybe a stupid question, but do people stick to just 3-4 laps like that in a session or repeat it? For example in a 15 minute session there would be time for more than 3-4 laps.

Do you then do something like

warmup, hot lap, cool down lap, hot lap, cool down lap and so on?

No stupid questions and yes in my experience at club level lots of people follow this pattern which is why watching your mirrors is very important and considered poor track etiquette if you fail to do so. 

  • Like 1

Of those, only good tyres are expensive, and if you are going to the track on street tyres (even good ones) you are missing most of the fun.

My old 33 gtst street car did about a billion laps in 20min sessions with:

- proper track tyres (these days I'd use hankook Z221)

-bendix ultimate pads, standard disc, calipers

-standard rad, no oil cooler etc

With under 200rwkw it was good for 1.09s at Wakefield, all day every day

I think what many posters above did is double or triple the factory power (or chuck a ls in), then put on road tyres and expect track happiness. Leave it turned down and enjoy the track instead!

 

  • Like 2

So you were over tyred for the power as I said above. 

A mate with an R33 and 300+rwkw on Z221s cannot get a full 20mins session from them, but my guess is he would've been doing faster than 1:09 at Wakefield, it's all relative. 

Nothing wrong with over tyring the car, but the reality is most people are running Z221/equivalent advans, and in my club, used slicks also, and will still cook the tyre in 20mins because the cars are far more powerful and suspension far more capable than it used to be allowing us all to go much faster. 

Same goes for any "issue". I could go a full 20mins and not see oil temps above 110, but the car had under 200kw, and very decent/ducted oil cooler setup. You can apply the same approach to any aspect of the car and when you do all of them you can go run 20mins flat out. They call those GT3 cars I think :D

Anyway, agree to disagree, but I think Johnny's pattern of hot/cool laps is fun for lots of club level cars. 
 

Edited by ActionDan
  • Like 3

In my case, the RB block became a consumable track day item more or less. The LS is far cheaper.

Oil temps skyrocket under high throttle. I would suspect your 33GTST street car was sitting at 150C for 19 of those 20 minute sessions without an oil cooler. That said, perhaps 150C oil temperature isn't actually as bad for everything as things may make it seem.

Leaving it tuned down and enjoying the track/driving it is VERY sage advice. Also generally "Track the car, and see what limits you first, then upgrade _that_" is the upgrade path of the smart person.

  • Like 3

Yeah my current weakest link are the tyres, if I change to proper semi slicks I "might" be able to do 3~5 hot laps, but something else might give instead LOL (this is for the GP Circuit at SMSP)

Hence somewhat I'm happy to just run street tyres.

Back in the Wakefield days, running Nitto NT01 I was able to do 5~8 hot laps at a time, the only thing that gave up was the brakes OR the motor would push coolant (when I had a stock motor pushing 372kW lol).

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



  • Similar Content

  • Latest Posts

    • After using a protractor for an actually accurate assessment of what is required,  and by NOT using my uncalibrated eyeball I worked out I need a 25° silicone bend from the TB ro the MAF, but, my choice was either a 30° or a 23° (23° is a weird spec), so I grabbed the 23° one from Raceworks I also grabbed 1mtr of 3" straight from Just Jap, I needed 350mm, but they only had 300mm, or 1mtr lengths....meh Also ordered a 1/2" hose bulkhead fitting from fleabay, this has a smoothish mushroom looking head (they are designed for below the water line of boats) that will fit inside the bend, the hose bit and threaded bit looks to long, but nothing that a hacksaw cannot fix if required, the hose will then just get jamed on the threaded bit up to the retaining nut Fingers crossed and the unsightly amount of hose clamps will be reduced down to 4 once all the parts arrive 
    • Oil change does not trigger code 21. Code 21 is for coilpacks primary side connection. You can try to clear the code with a battery disconnect, hold down the brake pedal to drain capacitors through the brake lights with the ignition on for 10-15 seconds before you reconnect the battery. I have seen R35 coil conversion permanently cause this code with no ill effects so it might be the resistance it wants to see isn't quite right on one or more coilpacks. Could be inside the ECU, could be the harness, could be a coil. You can test it all if you want or just ignore until the car actually starts misfiring.
    • I forgot you have a Nistune ECU. Use Nistune to do all the tests I mentioned instead of faffing with 30+ year old electrical connectors. You can read MAF volts off that too, there are reference values in the service manual to tell you roughly what it should be in different conditions.
    • No. I think it might be the AFM. Hence the use of the terms "swaptronics", which implies the use of swapping out electronics for the purpose of diagnosis. It's about the only way to prove that a small/niggling/whatever problem with an AFM or a CAS or similar is actually caused by that AFM/CAS/whatever. A known good item swapped in that still gives the same problem is likely to be caused somewhere else. They're all the same. Spraying AFMs with cleaner is an each way bet between cleaning it and f**king it.
    • Oh wow! This might actually work amazingly. Do you know the ratio of the diff? I was told the only thing you need to make sure of is if the front & rear diff ratios are the same. Ours is a 4.083 Thanks!
×
×
  • Create New...