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Wont start unless i have the pedal to the floor

kevboost7
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kevboost7 Community Regular

kevboost7

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I bought the NZEFI 1000CC injectors with the ballaster resistor delete pack. It started fine for a few days and even drove it to the Tuners dyno and back. Then one day i drove it to work, and on my way out of the office, the car wouldn't start. Unless i put the gas pedal all the way to the floor and then crank the engine over. 

Called the tuner and we tried a bunch of different settings but trying to figure it out now. Anyone else experience this? Haltech Platninum Pro.

https://www.nzefi.com/product/nissan-rb-1000ccmin-top-feed-direct-fit-fuel-injector-kit/

Duncan Grand Master

Duncan

Posted
Posted

After you start it by holding the throttle wide open, does it then idle correctly without throttle or does it stall?

If not it sounds like one of the injectors might be stuck partly open. You could also drain your oil and check for a heap of fuel in it.

If it doesn't idle there is something wrong with the tune (unlikely, because it worked when it was tuned), or something changed on your car like the AAC or cold start valve no longer working correctly.

BTW, I know we are a multi-cultural forum now, but "gas" makes no sense as a term for the pedal that opens a petrol engine's throttle, either directly or electronically.

kevboost7 Community Regular

kevboost7

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23 minutes ago, Duncan said:

After you start it by holding the throttle wide open, does it then idle correctly without throttle or does it stall?

If not it sounds like one of the injectors might be stuck partly open. You could also drain your oil and check for a heap of fuel in it.

If it doesn't idle there is something wrong with the tune (unlikely, because it worked when it was tuned), or something changed on your car like the AAC or cold start valve no longer working correctly.

BTW, I know we are a multi-cultural forum now, but "gas" makes no sense as a term for the pedal that opens a petrol engine's throttle, either directly or electronically.

It idles and drives just fine after starting. A bit rich on the wideband on initial startup but dosen't stall or anything. 
If its one of the injectors stuck open how do i figure out which one?

Gas pedal is the term we use in america lol, we say, "give it some gas", which means give it some throttle. 

kevboost7 Community Regular

kevboost7

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4 minutes ago, Dose Pipe Sutututu said:

Post up your injector settings, and also your fuel cranking table.

If it's in ms and not in VE, you're probably flooding the motor during crank.

Screenshot2025-02-12at5_17_21PM.thumb.png.9c6e994db2d522e92ed94f4d7eafa638.pngThese are the injector settings. I dont see the Fuel cranking table. Its not here on the Haltech Platinum Pro's - ECU manager. image.thumb.png.9066bc282d9b0599ba372f197763872c.png Do you see it on the navigation tree?

GTSBoy Grand Master

GTSBoy

Posted
Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Dose Pipe Sutututu said:

If it's in ms and not in VE, you're probably flooding the motor during crank.

Very likely this.

10 minutes ago, kevboost7 said:

If its one of the injectors stuck open how do i figure out which one?

Unplug them one at a time and try to start it. A faulty one will be quickly revealed.

10 minutes ago, kevboost7 said:

Gas pedal is the term we use in america lol, we say, "give it some gas", which means give it some throttle.

Yeah, we know that. But calling it the gas pedal was always daft. America deciding that the fuel was to be called gasoline, instead of petrol was...maybe fair enough. There's nothing too special about the word petroleum to make it necessarily better than the alternative. But the pedal never, not once in the history of the 4-stroke spark ignition internal combustion engine, ever controlled the fuel. It controlled the air. It was the pedal that actuated the throttle. It still is the pedal that actuates the throttle.

Edited by GTSBoy
Dumbo typo
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Duncan Grand Master

Duncan

Posted
Posted

Sorry Kevin, didn't mean to raise it, just one of those things that still bugs me after all this time :)

It doesn't make sense that it is a tune issue if it did start OK for a while....having said that this is my cranking table with half the injector you have (550s)

image.png

BTW Dose, great movie

Kinkstaah Grand Master

Kinkstaah

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, kevboost7 said:

Gas pedal is the term we use in america lol, we say, "give it some gas", which means give it some throttle. 

It actually means give it less throttle. :wink:

MBS206 Grand Master

MBS206

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Posted

Let's be wary though, if cranking is so far off, what else isn't set right?

Are the dead times set right, voltage compensation etc?

 

It definitely sounds like it's cranking fuel issues, and holding flat to the floor is shutting them down, but I'm with Duncan that if nothing was changed in the ECU at all, and then this started, I'd be more thinking a leaking injector.

 

Do as Duncan said, drop the oil and make sure it's not full of fuel.

Dose Pipe Sutututu Grand Master

Dose Pipe Sutututu

Posted
Posted

Can you show us the Inj Dead Time table?

 

When cranking, does the car start then dies without WOT? OR it's not even starting/catching at all?

If it catches and dies, you may need to add more fuel to the Post-Start Enrichment table

image.thumb.png.3aae17ab23057551d708cb69afeb247a.png

kevboost7 Community Regular

kevboost7

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2 hours ago, Duncan said:

Sorry Kevin, didn't mean to raise it, just one of those things that still bugs me after all this time :)

It doesn't make sense that it is a tune issue if it did start OK for a while....having said that this is my cranking table with half the injector you have (550s)

image.png

BTW Dose, great movie

My tuner gave me a few tunes to try while we were troubleshooting this issue, so i believe this was one of the tables where he modified it to be extremely on the high end just to see if it helped. 

What does this table mean? the milliseconds that the injectors are open between 0-400RPMs at the varying coolant temperatures?

kevboost7 Community Regular

kevboost7

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3 hours ago, GTSBoy said:

Very likely this.

Unplug them one at a time and try to start it. A faulty one will be quickly revealed.

Yeah, we know that. But calling it the gas pedal was always daft. America deciding that the fuel was to be called gasoline, instead of petrol was...maybe fair enough. There's nothing too special about the word petroleum to make it necessarily better than the alternative. But the pedal never, not once in the history of the 4-stroke spark ignition internal combustion engine, ever controlled the fuel. It controlled the air. It was the pedal that actuated the throttle. It still is the pedal that actuates the throttle.

Ok so my table is in ms? Ill try to unplug them one at a time. If i unplug 1 injector wont it be misfiring? 

The gas pedal should be called the "air-pedal" 🤣

  • Haha 1
Duncan Grand Master

Duncan

Posted
Posted

Re the injectors, yes it would missfire but what you are looking for is current behaviour (no start without full throttle) stops and the car starts without throttle (then idles with a miss)

kevboost7 Community Regular

kevboost7

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43 minutes ago, Dose Pipe Sutututu said:

Can you show us the Inj Dead Time table?

 

When cranking, does the car start then dies without WOT? OR it's not even starting/catching at all?

If it catches and dies, you may need to add more fuel to the Post-Start Enrichment table

image.thumb.png.3aae17ab23057551d708cb69afeb247a.png

image.thumb.png.d9804bf7542665849554054f49ae6b38.png
Injector Dead Time Table^^ 

No the car just cranks and cranks and never catches. It will for 1 second act like its catching but die then cranks and cranks and never starts. 

If i push the gas pedal/air-pedal/give it max throttle then it will start. 

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