[Closed] Borg Warner Efr Series Turbos

[nik.]

Hey Guys,

whats peoples thoughts on this turbo; Borg Warner s366 with extended tip.

spec;

Twinscroll T4 flange V band out beveled 4.21" Full Marmon flange

.91 turbine a/r

Flows upto 80lbs/min

Supports upto 800hp

included: T4 mounting gasket and oil drain gasket

Turbine housing V band outlet can be machined down to a flat 4" upon request after purchase if desired

Looking at selling the GT35 T3 1.06 for this... whats peoples thoughts?

its going onto a RB30 Twin cam??

if your not specifically looking for an EFR series, look at the genuine

borg warner s300sx 88/75 http://www.full-race.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=214_1167&products_id=1907

borg warner s300sx 91/79 http://www.full-race.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=214_1167&products_id=1908

s366 is a BW turbo rebranded by bullseye power with more exhaust housing options ( bw mainly make t4 twinscroll where as BEP have t3 open housings)

[BMYHOE]

Pump gas GT3582R .82a/r (magenta) versus EFR8374 .83a/r (green) - both T3 open housing on a K20A Honda motor running 1bar of boost - clearly doesn't need huge boost or fancy fuel to give gains, and no more lag.

Well that looks pretty good! looks like a 40HP Difference!

cant wait to see some RB30 Dyno graphs....

[T04GTR]

Hey Guys,

whats peoples thoughts on this turbo; Borg Warner s366 with extended tip.

spec;

Twinscroll T4 flange V band out beveled 4.21" Full Marmon flange

.91 turbine a/r

Flows upto 80lbs/min

Supports upto 800hp

included: T4 mounting gasket and oil drain gasket

Turbine housing V band outlet can be machined down to a flat 4" upon request after purchase if desired

Looking at selling the GT35 T3 1.06 for this... whats peoples thoughts?

its going onto a RB30 Twin cam??

would be perfect! i was going to get one but instead got a s372r from bullseye. someone needs to makle them better known in this country..

[Beelzebub89]

Anyone got anymore info on these turbos? Very keen to see how the 6258 goes in twin configuration on a 26 or 26/30.

[Lithium]

I will definitely update this thread when I can find some useful info

[Lithium]

Thought I'd share some results from another forum - I think most people here are on-to-it enough to understand whats going on so I'll keep my observations to a minimum:

The guy doing these tests (Jeff from Perrin Performance in the US) commented that he was a bit thrown by these results, as the "seat of the pants" impression was that it actually outspooled the GT3076R and GTX3076R turbos he had tested previously on the road, and felt generally more responsive and quicker to recover boost on gear changes - while on the dyno with a steady state rpm increase it appears overall more comparable with a .63a/r GTX3582R in spool and somewhere between the .63 and .82 GTX3582R in flow.

He compared a datalog he did with the GTX3076R (green) on the road with one of the EFR7670 (red) and found that even though he went WOT slightly earlier in the GTX3076R log the EFR7670 matches it for full boost at the same rpm and time stamp - meaning it had boost built the boost and climbed rpm in a shorter period of time, aka faster boost threshold

My impressions so far from this test are that the EFR7670 in terms of dyno results is going to be most comparable with a GT3582R that spools slightly faster, but it appears than on the road it'll actually drive more like a "fast" GT3076R.

Its worth noting that these are comparing T3 open housing turbos all around, the Garretts are all externally gated while the Borg Warner is internally gated. A twin scroll Borg Warner EFR7670 could potentially be completely insane on an RB25DET after seeing these results, I reckon.

[SimonR32]

Not bad at all for a internal vs external gate...

Do you know if the externally gated garrets were plumbed back or venting to atmosphere?

[Beer Baron]

would like to see the same tests done with the TS EFR turbo. I believe that is where they shine a bit more.

[Lithium]

Totally, though the same would apply to the GTX turbos too. The big plus is the TS EFR also comes internally gated. I am pretty sure the wastegate is plumbed back in with those examples.

Also for some fun, a Type-R Integra running pump gas with an overlay from 21psi runs done with a GT3582R (orange dotted line), EFR8374 (blue line), then EFR9180 (orange dot/dash line):

[Beer Baron]

makes the 9180 look like a good choice. but id want a bite more than 600hp atw. do you know what size turbine housing is on the 9180 and is it TS or non TS? ex gate or iwg?

[Lithium]

makes the 9180 look like a good choice. but id want a bite more than 600hp atw. do you know what size turbine housing is on the 9180 and is it TS or non TS? ex gate or iwg?

All open housing, internal gate I believe. That was on 21psi on a 2litre 4cylinder on pump gas - that will be by no means the limit

[Beelzebub89]

Thanks for the update Mr Lith Hopefully some more people start using these turbos over here so we can see some more results. It's looking very promising so far though.

[Harey]

Isnt that comparison a bit unfair for the Borg Warner EFR turbos being Internally Wastegated compared to the Garret's which are Externally Wastegated?

I thought external wastegate made more power at the same boost level in most cases.

It seems like they went to a great effort for these tests, I wonder why they didnt choose an IWG Garret to make the comparison fairer?

[R31Nismoid]

I thought external wastegate made more power at the same boost level in most cases.

Wastegate simply controls boost via exhaust.

It has nothing to do with power vs boost.

It's simply about flowing enough gas so that you don't have boost spike issues like some internal wastegate models have. If the internal gate is big enough, there is no reason why it will not perform the same.

Imagine the below scenario. All are 600hp turbos with identical specs except wastegate.

Turbo A - 20mm IW

Turbo B - 40mm IW

Turbo C - 45mm EW

They will all make the same power. However boost control with Turbo A is going to be a major issue.

Turbos B & C by rights, should pretty much perform the same.

The only reason Turbo C might be better - exhaust restrictive issues. Turbo C might have an advantage if the gate is vent to atmo over Turbo B if the cars exhaust is not flowing enough

Just think GTR turbos. They don't use external gates and you can see 450rwkw easily enough with 800hp lowmounts.

[Harey]

Yeah I get what your saying and not saying IWGs cant make big power but doesnt external gate get rid of a lot of heat and flow. Yeah if the dump pipe behind the IWG is big enough and its a good design then yeah it can equal an EWG.

With these comparisons you are comparing the same size dump pipe plus the external wastegate would equate to better exhaust flow for the Garrets. Yes not a lot but 5-10kw in this comparison would be a significant difference.

[BMYHOE]

Thanks for the update Mr Lith Hopefully some more people start using these turbos over here so we can see some more results. It's looking very promising so far though.

Well guys, i just ordered a Borg Warner EFR 9180 with the t4 divided Twin scorll housing (external gate)

brought it through GCG though they told me there is about 3 - 4 week wait for them to arrive...

cant wait

[T04GTR]

beat me to it! im going to give a s300 8875 a try first.

[Beer Baron]

well I have ordered a 9180 EFR TS housing (twin ex gate) back in november 2010. still waiting but it should be coming soon. I will do my nut if bumhoe gets his first though! we ordered and paid last year!!!

pretty keen to see it go. hopefully it'll be the first in aus.

[BMYHOE]

well I have ordered a 9180 EFR TS housing (twin ex gate) back in november 2010. still waiting but it should be coming soon. I will do my nut if bumhoe gets his first though! we ordered and paid last year!!!

pretty keen to see it go. hopefully it'll be the first in aus.

LOL,

well dont worry you'll def be the first with results as im rebuilding the whole car..

still at least 6-8months away before dyno etc..

Be sure to post your results.

are you using a 3ltr baron?

[Lithium]

Very interesting results showed up for an EFR6758 being used part of a new bolton kit for Chevy Cobalts, they ran it up to 35psi on E85 and it pushed out 540whp on a Mustang dyno - which are one of the harshest reading rolling road dynos out there, by reputation.

It made over 500whp on 30psi, and had 35psi (internally gated) by 4100rpm on a 2litre. Pretty impressive stuff!