Jump to content
SAU Community

Recommended Posts

Debating going to a Spool spline Drive oil pump gear setup, has anyone seen any failures, weird wear?

I currently have a Tomei Pump, Recently broke the Snout of my crank off at the track (no idea why) this has me thinking about switching to a different perhaps better setup.

 

Whats everyones thoughts on this these days..

There’s quite a few workshops in Melbourne who’ve used them with N1 oil pumps for years now. From Rb28’s to RB34’s. No failures or breakages, have run mid 7 second passes well over 1000hp and 8500rpm without issues and still going strong. Wish I did it when I had my motor built

  • 1 month later...
On 5/16/2018 at 4:49 PM, mitchum said:

Debating going to a Spool spline Drive oil pump gear setup, has anyone seen any failures, weird wear?

I currently have a Tomei Pump, Recently broke the Snout of my crank off at the track (no idea why) this has me thinking about switching to a different perhaps better setup.

 

Whats everyones thoughts on this these days..

If you have a Tomei Pump you do not need to scrap it. We supply a full conversion to Spline Drive. You would be better off with a Tomei as it it a better overal Pump.

D4CB4B58-AC83-4468-B4AE-D96D9D41E860.jpeg

16 hours ago, Frracer said:

If you have a Tomei Pump you do not need to scrap it. We supply a full conversion to Spline Drive. You would be better off with a Tomei as it it a better overal Pump.

D4CB4B58-AC83-4468-B4AE-D96D9D41E860.jpeg

I went with the Spool gears, yours are almost double the money.. i agree the Tomei pump is a better housing however.. having that much flow seems to cause more issues then it fixed..

 

Edited by mitchum
3 hours ago, burn4005 said:

I'm confused, a tomei rb26 oil pump is a spline drive. What Harmonic damper were you using when the snout snapped?

Its still driven by the conventional method 2 flat spots on drive.. there are splines on the Tomei gears but not technically a spline drive.. my Tomei didnt fail me however it got pretty beat up with the crank snout breaking. I was using a Ross pulley.

I went back to an N1 pump housing i ported the entry and exits so it flows a little easier.. 

Tomei pump is good and all but having that much flow isnt really needed IMO.. causes more issues than it fixes with oil pooling in head and or sucking sump dry... Stock VG30 pumps and 2JZ pumps work just fine for 1000hp.. no reason a properly driven N1 pump cant supply a sufficient amount of oil.

  • Like 2
  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 months later...

I have installed the Spool spline drive gears in a New N1 housing that i ported a bit. Its in the car and running. Seems to be working well.

 

My only concern was the fairly low pressure at idle.. used to be about 20psi with the Tomei. It is now at around 12psi hot.. but goes up quickly with revs so should be fine as long as it doesnt go any lower.

This engine should make north of 800whp so report back if anyone wants updates.

  • Like 1
21 hours ago, mitchum said:

I have installed the Spool spline drive gears in a New N1 housing that i ported a bit. Its in the car and running. Seems to be working well.

This engine should make north of 800whp so report back if anyone wants updates.

Would be good if you have a few pics of the work on your pump housing?

And with the hp level, presuming you might have the right sensor setup to log oil pressure?  Be good if you can post up a log run to show oil pump performance

FWIW (might not even be on-topic) but I also decided to NOT go the spline drive route, after reading countless forums, blog posts, watching fat Jim talk about oil pumps and shit it seems the general consensus is that the spline drive needs the motor to have perfect tolerances, etc.

Most of the time when we build motors, we all end up line boring the block, this "generally" shifts the crank position by a bee's dick and because your oil pumps cannot be shifted that direction by whatever you end up unevenly driving the spline drive.

With my new motor for the shitbox, I just re-used the OEM NEO oil pump (which I believe it similar as a N1) and used the Spool billet gears. Crank was machined down, and the extended collar fitted with 2x grub screws.

I also run a host of sensors and can log oil pressure vs. engine speed vs. oil temp and water temp for anyone interested. It's on a Haltech Elite with no additional boxes (no need to insert Haltech box jokes). Happy to post whatever data people want :)

 

  • Like 2
  • Haha 1
1 hour ago, Dose Pipe Sutututu said:

 

Most of the time when we build motors, we all end up line boring the block, this "generally" shifts the crank position by a bee's dick and because your oil pumps cannot be shifted that direction by whatever you end up unevenly driving the spline drive.

 

This is exactly what happens when you line bore, and when you do go spline driven pumps you are meant to take out the locating pins on the block for the oil pump. Install the pump, finger tighten the bolts turn the crank a few times to center it up and then tighten the bolts to spec. 

23 hours ago, Dale FZ1 said:

Would be good if you have a few pics of the work on your pump housing?

And with the hp level, presuming you might have the right sensor setup to log oil pressure?  Be good if you can post up a log run to show oil pump performance

I just blended the entry and exits inside the pump so they would flow better than a straight sharp edged hole.

3 hours ago, r34unit said:

This is exactly what happens when you line bore, and when you do go spline driven pumps you are meant to take out the locating pins on the block for the oil pump. Install the pump, finger tighten the bolts turn the crank a few times to center it up and then tighten the bolts to spec. 

I used a dial indicator to setup the pump, drilled the dowel holes larger in pump housing and centered pump over crank with 2 dial indicators. What ive noticed over the years of building these engines is even from the factory..  the alignment isnt spot on, which could be the reason some guys get away with stock oil pumps alot longer than others.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



  • Similar Content

  • Latest Posts

    • Power is fed to the ECU when the ignition switch is switched to IGN, at terminal 58. That same wire also connects to the ECCS relay to provide both the coil power and the contact side. When the ECU sees power at 58 it switches 16 to earth, which pulls the ECCS relay on, which feeds main power into the ECU and also to a bunch of other things. None of this is directly involved in the fuel pump - it just has to happen first. The ECU will pull terminal 18 to earth when it wants the fuel pump to run. This allows the fuel pump relay to pull in, which switches power on into the rest of the fuel pump control equipment. The fuel pump control regulator is controlled from terminal 104 on the ECU and is switched high or low depending on whether the ECU thinks the pump needs to run high or low. (I don't know which way around that is, and it really doesn't matter right now). The fuel pump control reg is really just a resistor that controls how the power through the pump goes to earth. Either straight to earth, or via the resistor. This part doesn't matter much to us today. The power to the fuel pump relay comes from one of the switched wires from the IGN switch and fusebox that is not shown off to the left of this page. That power runs the fuel pump relay coil and a number of other engine peripherals. Those peripherals don't really matter. All that matters is that there should be power available at the relay when the key is in the right position. At least - I think it's switched. If it's not switched, then power will be there all the time. Either way, if you don't have power there when you need it (ie, key on) then it won't work. The input-output switching side of the relay gains its power from a line similar (but not the same as) the one that feeds the ECU. SO I presume that is switched. Again, if there is not power there when you need it, then you have to look upstream. And... the upshot of all that? There is no "ground" at the fuel pump relay. Where you say: and say that pin 1 Black/Pink is ground, that is not true. The ECU trigger is AF73, is black/pink, and is the "ground". When the ECU says it is. The Blue/White wire is the "constant" 12V to power the relay's coil. And when I say "constant", I mean it may well only be on when the key is on. As I said above. So, when the ECU says not to be running the pump (which is any time after about 3s of switching on, with no crank signal or engine speed yet), then you should see 12V at both 1 and 2. Because the 12V will be all the way up to the ECU terminal 18, waiting to be switched to ground. When the ECU switches the fuel pump on, then AF73 should go to ~0V, having been switched to ground and the voltage drop now occurring over the relay coil. 3 & 5 are easy. 5 is the other "constant" 12V, that may or may not be constant but will very much want to be there when the key is on. Same as above. 3 goes to the pump. There should never be 12V visible at 3 unless the relay is pulled in. As to where the immobiliser might have been spliced into all this.... It will either have to be on wire AF70 or AF71, whichever is most accessible near the alarm. Given that all those wires run from the engine bay fusebox or the ECU, via the driver's area to the rear of the car, it could really be either. AF70 will be the same colour from the appropriate fuse all the way to the pump. If it has been cut and is dangling, you should be able to see that  in that area somewhere. Same with AF71.   You really should be able to force the pump to run. Just jump 12V onto AF72 and it should go. That will prove that the pump itself is willing to go along with you when you sort out the upstream. You really should be able to force the fuel pump relay on. Just short AF73 to earth when the key is on. If the pump runs, then the relay is fine, and all the power up to both inputs on the relay is fine. If it doesn't run (and given that you checked the relay itself actually works) then one or both of AF70 and AF71 are not bringing power to the game.
    • @PranK can you elaborate further on the Colorlock Dye? The website has a lot of options. I'm sure you've done all the research. I have old genuine leather seats that I have bought various refurbing creams and such, but never a dye. Any info on how long it lasts? Does it wash out? Is it a hassle? What product do I actually need? Am I just buying this kit and following the steps the page advises or something else? https://www.colourlockaustralia.com.au/colourlock-leather-repair-kit-dye.html
    • These going to fit over the big brakes? I'd be reeeeeeeeaaaall hesitant to believe so.
    • The leather work properly stunned me. Again, I am thankful that the leather was in such good condition. I'm not sure what the indent is at the top of the passenger seat. Like somebody was sitting in it with a golf ball between their shoulders. The wheels are more grey than silver now and missing a lot of gloss.  Here's one with nice silver wheels.
    • It's amazing how well the works on the leather seats. Looks mint. Looking forward to see how you go with the wheels. They do suit the car! Gutter rash is easy to fix, but I'm curious about getting the colour done.
×
×
  • Create New...