Ideas why engine won't take timing?

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

Do this, set the entire timing map to 20 degrees for the vac area, now hit it with a timing might and hold the RPM from 1000 to 2000 to 3000 all the way to 6000 and see if there's timing scatter, it should hold 20 regardless of the RPM you're at.

If the timing does move/scatter that's one of the reasons why the car won't take timing. Could be from a faulty CAS (Nissan optical special) or noise with your wiring.

[oxford1327]

4 minutes ago, admS15 said:

What was the previous intercooler setup and are you sure the new one is more efficient? Do have iat readings?

 

Is the intake tract and cooler piping internally clean or is there oily residue from blowby, excessive blowby can also cause pinging if substantial enough. Catch can can help here.

 

As already stated e85 will help mask the issue but better to be sorted properly.

Old intercooler was return flow from just jap, new cooler flows heaps better intake tract is about 1.2mtrs shorter and runs a lot cooler to the touch even after about an hour of driving, still cold to touch, all new piping so clean as a whistle and showed no improvement with timing issues after changed to new cooler

[oxford1327]

8 minutes ago, Dose Pipe Sutututu said:

Do this, set the entire timing map to 20 degrees for the vac area, now hit it with a timing might and hold the RPM from 1000 to 2000 to 3000 all the way to 6000 and see if there's timing scatter, it should hold 20 regardless of the RPM you're at.

If the timing does move/scatter that's one of the reasons why the car won't take timing. Could be from a faulty CAS (Nissan optical special) or noise with your wiring.

Will get the guys to look into this as soon as ecu is back from Nistune, cheers 

[admS15]

Old intercooler was return flow from just jap, new cooler flows heaps better intake tract is about 1.2mtrs shorter and runs a lot cooler to the touch even after about an hour of driving, still cold to touch, all new piping so clean as a whistle and showed no improvement with timing issues after changed to new cooler

The return flow should have been good enough to provide much better results than what you got, so would definitely not be the issue. Dosepipe's suggestion above is a good one.

[oxford1327]

OK thanks to all for the insight, I'll show the guys working on it all of the suggestions and see if we can find a favorable resolution 

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

A faulty CAS can be the issue, so can an incorrectly timed motor, ie belt not on properly.

[daneprostamobrown]

45 minutes ago, admS15 said:

52 minutes ago, oxford1327 said:

Old intercooler was return flow from just jap, new cooler flows heaps better intake tract is about 1.2mtrs shorter and runs a lot cooler to the touch even after about an hour of driving, still cold to touch, all new piping so clean as a whistle and showed no improvement with timing issues after changed to new cooler

The return flow should have been good enough to provide much better results than what you got, so would definitely not be the issue. Dosepipe's suggestion above is a good one.

I disagree I have dyno pressure drop tested my blitz return flow and they are crap. It’s my limiting factor currently but will be doing back to back comparison with new plazmaman pro series gtr cooler when I get around to fitting it

[admS15]

I disagree I have dyno pressure drop tested my blitz return flow and they are crap. It’s my limiting factor currently but will be doing back to back comparison with new plazmaman pro series gtr cooler when I get around to fitting it

Sure a plazmaman pro series is much better than a return flow cooler but that's not the limiting factor here. Plenty people here have made reasonable power with them without running into the issues op here has.

[KiwiRS4T]

I'd bet quids on it being the wrong pistons. I have seen it done before (I think it was Dave B with his S2 who tried everything but ended up being an engine out job to fit another set of pistons)  and it seems the correct pistons have to be a custom order as they are hard to find in stock anywhere. Do a compression test  - that will cost you nothing and give you an instant answer

[oxford1327]

2 hours ago, KiwiRS4T said:

I'd bet quids on it being the wrong pistons. I have seen it done before (I think it was Dave B with his S2 who tried everything but ended up being an engine out job to fit another set of pistons)  and it seems the correct pistons have to be a custom order as they are hard to find in stock anywhere. Do a compression test  - that will cost you nothing and give you an instant answer

Yeah we are doin a comp test as soon as ecu is back in car, as well as changing the cas contraption on front of engine, and hopefully either of those will be a steer in the direction of the issue 

 

[Ben C34]

You don't need an ecu to do a comp test. Even better to do it now with it removed as injectors won't spay fuel.

[oxford1327]

5 minutes ago, Ben C34 said:

You don't need an ecu to do a comp test. Even better to do it now with it removed as injectors won't spay fuel.

Fair enough, ecu is on way back from Nistune so should be in the hand either tomorrow or Friday 

[KiwiRS4T]

So how did the compression test go?

[oxford1327]

5 minutes ago, KiwiRS4T said:

So how did the compression test go?

I've been at work all weekend so I dunno, will be calling the workshop tomorrow to see if it's been done, dropped off the ecu on Friday morning and they were going to be spannering on it that arvo, so am hoping it's been tested etc

[KiwiRS4T]

On 6/23/2019 at 7:33 PM, oxford1327 said:

I've been at work all weekend so I dunno, will be calling the workshop tomorrow to see if it's been done, dropped off the ecu on Friday morning and they were going to be spannering on it that arvo, so am hoping it's been tested etc

They don't like what they found and are avoiding you?

[oxford1327]

4 hours ago, KiwiRS4T said:

They don't like what they found and are avoiding you?

Nah not at all, engine is running again as of last night, new flex fuel pump and lines, adjustable reg, hardwire kit etc etc were all fitted yesterday, so now the testing will commence. 

And I thought I was half impatient, jeebus  Hahahah KiwiRS4T you're keener than me!, but I spose I'm half dreading the outcome since it could possibly be a wallet drainer.... ? 

[Dose Pipe Sutututu]

15 minutes ago, oxford1327 said:

possibly be a wallet drainer.... ? 

The joys of owning a 90s JDM car lol

All this work and a BMW 135i with a reflash will be faster (I'll stop talking about Golfs because people get upset).

Don't worry, I'm just as delusional, I built a R33 I hate driving.

[KiwiRS4T]

5 hours ago, oxford1327 said:

Nah not at all, engine is running again as of last night, new flex fuel pump and lines, adjustable reg, hardwire kit etc etc were all fitted yesterday, so now the testing will commence. 

And I thought I was half impatient, jeebus  Hahahah KiwiRS4T you're keener than me!, but I spose I'm half dreading the outcome since it could possibly be a wallet drainer.... ? 

If you have got very high compression you may be able to get away with it with E85 and a good tune.  Talking about wallet drainers over 5 years I spent over $40,000 on a C34 Stagea - I could get quite a good RS6 for that now!

[oxford1327]

2 hours ago, KiwiRS4T said:

If you have got very high compression you may be able to get away with it with E85 and a good tune.  Talking about wallet drainers over 5 years I spent over $40,000 on a C34 Stagea - I could get quite a good RS6 for that now!

I'd love an audi rs6 but I'm not bulk rich, so the stagea is as close as I'll get ha ha ha, and yeah fully agree that if I added it all up between car and bikes over the years it'd be a comfortable house ?

[oxford1327]

finally have an update after what seems like for-bloody-ever!!!!

thankfully the car is now taking timing and we think it was a combination of a dodgy AFM (bosch rip-off) and the CAS on the front of the motor not reading correctly and confusing each other .

the Bosch AFM was purchased from a reputable parts company for just under $300, so they are going to take it back and assess it to see whether it is a dodgy unit or just a plain out and out rip-off unit that snuck through from their supply chain.

several other OEM Jecs AFM units were tried, but as they are no longer available through nissan the units were all second hand, and took a few goes to get one that was reading correctly, had one that was leaning out real bad, another that just flat out threw codes, and finally on the 3rd go we stole the one of the tuners own R32 and used it for now to get the car at least half way tuned.

picked up the car today so that i can drive it while the tuners missus goes in to have their kidlet, then once hes back on deck we can get the tune finished off for both 98 and the sugar juice E85, for the most part the E85 tuning is done with a few different dilution ratios, but so far the thing is a frickin rocket compared to before, it is holding 20+ psi no problem and pulling like a train, so cant wait to see how it goes once the tune is all tickled up.

now all i am pondering is whether to keep the factory airbox with the K+N panel filter, or go to a boxed pod, as it has the pod on at the moment and am liking the flutter hahahaha, can anybody point me in the right direction for a pod box that isnt too much of a turd to fit?