Hi octane crank trigger kit

[jet09s]

Hi guys, not sure if this is the right section. But im in the process of getting a rb26 engine built. Mechanic has suggested going with the  hi octane crank trigger kit. Which is on special for $875 atm. Is regards this setup as far superior to the factory cas. Could I get pro s and con s of the guys running a trigger setup over the factory cas. Ill be running it with Vipec/link ecu. Thanks guys

[GTSBoy]

The pros are that if they are done right then they are far better than the factory CAS (for hard working engines that is.  For stockers, who gives a rat's?).  The cons are that when they are bad they are very very bad.  Spitting belts and other shenanigans can really take the shine off something that was supposed to make life better.

[r32-25t]

I’ve git the hioctane one on my car and the only con was i had to change the balancer as well cause it wouldn’t fit behind the factory one. So apart from that everything is better 

[NEO25T]

I have a platinum racing one sitting there waiting to go on the new motor, apparently they can be used with the factory balancer. I hope that is right as i somehow ended up ordering 2 new balancers, would be a shame if i couldnt use 1 of them lol.

The high octane cam sensor has the cover and looks way nicer.

Edited March 9, 2018 by NEO25T
Spelling

[burn4005]

cons = poor designs can cause belt alignment issues for ones mounted to timing gear, have to pull balancer (balancer bolt on a RB26 is a prick of a thing at 446nm), timing belt, timing gear etc to install.

pros = everything else

can use an AEM 24+1 cas disk in the stock optical cas if you want the stock look, and only use the cam reset signal on the inner sensor. platinum sell crank only kits if you want to save a few bucks.

[bilk06169]

do you loose your a/c with any of these setups. im aware you do with the ross kit 

[klutched]

8 hours ago, bilk06169 said:

do you loose your a/c with any of these setups. im aware you do with the ross kit 

Not anymore, they have an a/c kit now to use with their race series damper.

[r32-25t]

I didn’t lose the a/c with mine 

[sneakey pete]

No issues with it on mine. Only Con is that they provide two of the 45mm red cherry sensors, where there is now a 25mm black version that would go way, way better in their upper cam housing. You can buy them pretty cheap locally too would suggest getting one if you're installing it and care about looks. I do prefer some of the other sensor mountings from other kits for the top, eg ross looks wise but from a practical standpoint its fine, also i've seen others which don't actually cover where the old cas was which is a bit of a worry, leaving belts exposed etc.

Con is you need to run the higher spec ATI balancer won't work wtih the lower spec, stock, or ross as far as I know. You don't loose anything going to said balancer, i have aircon running on it with mine, though you probably need to bring the cutoff down as its overspun vs stock balancer.

 

 

Also, regarding platinum kit i've heard that it wont fit some balancers that they claim though i'm unsure on the resolution of that case.

[STATUS]

18 hours ago, burn4005 said:

cons = poor designs can cause belt alignment issues for ones mounted to timing gear, have to pull balancer (balancer bolt on a RB26 is a prick of a thing at 446nm), timing belt, timing gear etc to install.

pros = everything else

can use an AEM 24+1 cas disk in the stock optical cas if you want the stock look, and only use the cam reset signal on the inner sensor. platinum sell crank only kits if you want to save a few bucks.

these AEM wheels are junk, same scatter as stock. Ive pulled about 5 out.

[Travis Trayhern]

Go see Protek Automotive they designed there own and can fit an tune correctly.

factory CAS are ribbish if your trying to use them on anything but stock ecu or PFC. for some reason the Pfc can just read the factory CAS without issues. 

what happens is the factory CAS gets interference at high rpm on other ecu’s and we have seen 10deg in timing jump while running with a scope at high rpm. This is not something your normal tuner or mechanic can see or do, you would be shocked at some big name tunners actually take the customers cars to Dom at Protek Automotive for these kits. 

Dom has been doing trigger kits and works directly with haltech and link to put in custom peramitors into the ecu to actually read the trigger kits correctly. Unles your tunner has a scope and has done it before don’t waste your time. 

Hope this helps

[STATUS]

51 minutes ago, Travis Trayhern said:

Go see Protek Automotive they designed there own and can fit an tune correctly.

factory CAS are ribbish if your trying to use them on anything but stock ecu or PFC. for some reason the Pfc can just read the factory CAS without issues. 

what happens is the factory CAS gets interference at high rpm on other ecu’s and we have seen 10deg in timing jump while running with a scope at high rpm. This is not something your normal tuner or mechanic can see or do, you would be shocked at some big name tunners actually take the customers cars to Dom at Protek Automotive for these kits. 

Dom has been doing trigger kits and works directly with haltech and link to put in custom peramitors into the ecu to actually read the trigger kits correctly. Unles your tunner has a scope and has done it before don’t waste your time. 

Hope this helps

very similar to others on the market.

[jet09s]

Thanks guys, I have a new 1000hp balancer on my motor. Which the kit will work with. I think I'm sold on the idea. I'll let you know how it goes. Appreciate the feedback.

[burn4005]

I think you have understood my recommendation about the AEM disc.

You use the single window of the aem wheel in the cas ONLY for the 720 degree cam reset. You'll get exactly the same accuracy of the reset signal as using the cherry sensor on the cam. It's only a reset, and the window on the aem disc is plenty wide enough.

Crank reference sensor is still a must for  a reliable 30degree signal.

Edited March 10, 2018 by burn4005

[SimonR32]

On 10/03/2018 at 6:35 AM, sneakey pete said:

No issues with it on mine. Only Con is that they provide two of the 45mm red cherry sensors, where there is now a 25mm black version that would go way, way better in their upper cam housing. You can buy them pretty cheap locally too would suggest getting one if you're installing it and care about looks. I do prefer some of the other sensor mountings from other kits for the top, eg ross looks wise but from a practical standpoint its fine, also i've seen others which don't actually cover where the old cas was which is a bit of a worry, leaving belts exposed etc.

Con is you need to run the higher spec ATI balancer won't work wtih the lower spec, stock, or ross as far as I know. You don't loose anything going to said balancer, i have aircon running on it with mine, though you probably need to bring the cutoff down as its overspun vs stock balancer.

 

 

Also, regarding platinum kit i've heard that it wont fit some balancers that they claim though i'm unsure on the resolution of that case.

I agree, was so disappointed that it came with the big red sensor rather than the small black one...

It also took me about 5 min to get over it...

Does anyone else run an inline resistor like the sensors are designed to have? I don't and get some weird rpm bounce on logs during transition from acceleration to overrun. Doesn't make a difference as there isn't really any need for accuracy there but still a little annoying. I'm going to try and resistor and see if it fixes it

[MagicMikeZ32]

Yes. I run a G4+, previously with the internal pullup. Just the other day I wired in a resistor and turned off the internal pullup.

Car still starts and trigger scope looks good, but that is no different to how it was. Haven't had a chance to drive it and log yet.

 

ECU pullup is 4.7K, sensor asks for a 1K @5V. My sensor runs 12V so from memory I used a 2.2K or something.

[burn4005]

I'd be surprised if that's required. as long as you set the trigger edge to falling it should be a consistant signal.

signal rise time is what they're trying to keep down with the lower ohm pullup. im guessing that the Cherrys have an unusually high capacitance if you need that much.

[SimonR32]

2 hours ago, burn4005 said:

I'd be surprised if that's required. as long as you set the trigger edge to falling it should be a consistant signal.

signal rise time is what they're trying to keep down with the lower ohm pullup. im guessing that the Cherrys have an unusually high capacitance if you need that much.

[burn4005]

Yes, those published specs will be for a rise time suitable for the rated freqency of >10khz using cherry's recommended tooth profile.

10krpm on a 12 tooth crank trigger is only 2000hz so nowhere near that. Happy to be shown a scope trace to be proven otherwise. 

 

But if this pull-up change has fixed your issue I'm happy to suck eggs, and is likely do to having excessive capacitance or very high resistance somewhere in your wiring.

 

But Sure, if this was a 60-2 wheel then by all means 1k is a good idea.

Edited March 22, 2018 by burn4005

[burn4005]

Also Simon for your rpm jumps, if your ecu allows you to set thr window of crank degrees for the rpm calculation it may be better to set this to 120 or 180 degrees so it has more teeth to look at.