Twins vs single vs 2 x singles lol

[r32-25t]

If you want to go all out big twin set up just do it properly and at least use a set of g30s or something. Even with billet wheels those trust turbos are dogs! Which would be why old mate took them off his car in the first place 

[r32-25t]

I’ve got a mate who put a billet wheel in a trust t78 to make it “better”, one ride in my car and its now going in the bin to be replaced with a 6466 

[khezz]

You are forgetting that it’s not just turbos that have developed. Everything has. Back in earlier days these kits were not run on 3.2l engines with counterbalanced cranks on E85 with FBW with flat shift. Even if they don’t spool until 5000rpm, I still have another 3500-5000rpm to go. The only time it would matter is on a circuit. I’m not going race people on the street while doing a school run. On the drag strip or during roll racing it will not matter. I just can’t see it being that big of an issue. I’m not chasing records. I’m building what I love. 

[BK]

Ok go hard then. 🤘

I guess if we're not going to completely shitcan this idea, maybe bringing it back into some form of reality might yield results ? While I think the twin 6875 idea as first mentioned is a bit ridiculously big, the idea of smaller frame could possibly work ?

Maybe twin 6266 or 6466 in reality ? When I was at Morpowa last year getting my R32 finalised guess what Simon tuned after my car ? Keir Wilson's R35 with his new twin Precision setup - it made over 1000kw at hubs.

Edit:

1061kw or 1423hp to be exact.

[khezz]

What happened to Kier and Willall racing? Didn’t they do the original r35 billet block?

[BK]

Willall racing is no more as Wilson and Donnon have parted ways. Now Keir uses Simon from Morpowa for his own cars. I personally cannot recommend Simon and Morpowa enough.

[robbo_rb180]

On 4/30/2022 at 4:37 PM, khezz said:

Kind of related to the topic. There is a twin trust T67 kit up for sale for 6k includes turbos, manifold, waste gate, down pipes, oil/water lines, twin entry trust drag intercooler and pipes from turbos to intercooler. They have been rebuilt and are in good nick. I am really keen to get rid of my 7685 kit and get that. I remember hearing and seeing that kit on Kier Wilson’s R32 when he ran 8s. These things look amazing and sound insane. They would spool ok to on a 3.2 with a sequential on e85. Looking specs, they flow up to 750hp each. 

Thats a mates kit.
He never ran it on his r32 as always changing engine setups, now onto his 2nd billet block.

Its cool in an old school way but if you have something modern ready to go I would try that first.

Another big twin kit
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1337571193401182/?ref=search&referral_code=marketplace_search&referral_story_type=post&tracking=browse_serp%3A6c394186-c690-400d-bad5-86120d84c9a7

[GTSBoy]

Stupid big twins = NOS to get it up, right?

[The Bogan]

I haven't owned a GTR, but if I did decide to get one, which is always possible, I would look for a car with twins in the original location 

Why, because I would only use it as a cruiser, and keeping it "twin turbo" would be with keeping the originality of the car

I also wouldn't worry about really big power either, just enough power for the street, I would be more interested in a responsive car that pulled from idle, over something that needed alot of revs and a big launch to beat a Hyundai i30 of from the lights

Stock body kit, stock wheels, stock intake, hell basically stock everything, including stock block

I'm kicking myself, in the balls, hard, really hard, that I didn't get a R32 GTR a few years ago when they were cheap

 

[khezz]

On 1/5/2022 at 6:32 AM, robbo_rb180 said:

Thats a mates kit.
He never ran it on his r32 as always changing engine setups, now onto his 2nd billet block.

Its cool in an old school way but if you have something modern ready to go I would try that first.

Another big twin kit
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1337571193401182/?ref=search&referral_code=marketplace_search&referral_story_type=post&tracking=browse_serp%3A6c394186-c690-400d-bad5-86120d84c9a7

Looks amazing. That’s pretty much perfect. My only concern is how it would line up inside an R32 engine bay. I have sent the link to my mechanic to see what issues there might be. 
 

thank you

[khezz]

On 1/5/2022 at 8:52 AM, mlr said:

I haven't owned a GTR, but if I did decide to get one, which is always possible, I would look for a car with twins in the original location 

Why, because I would only use it as a cruiser, and keeping it "twin turbo" would be with keeping the originality of the car

I also wouldn't worry about really big power either, just enough power for the street, I would be more interested in a responsive car that pulled from idle, over something that needed alot of revs and a big launch to beat a Hyundai i30 of from the lights

Stock body kit, stock wheels, stock intake, hell basically stock everything, including stock block

I'm kicking myself, in the balls, hard, really hard, that I didn't get a R32 GTR a few years ago when they were cheap

 

I started with that exact idea. Just a simple forges 2.6 with twin low mount GTXs. It blew out of proportion so quick. 
 

A 3.2 with 9.0 compression ratio on E85 is not going to be bad to drive off boost. Plus I realised that I’m building a copy of just about every other 1000hp gtr. I am not sure I want to do that. 

[Lithium]

On 01/05/2022 at 1:29 AM, khezz said:

You are forgetting that it’s not just turbos that have developed. Everything has. Back in earlier days these kits were not run on 3.2l engines with counterbalanced cranks on E85 with FBW with flat shift. Even if they don’t spool until 5000rpm, I still have another 3500-5000rpm to go. The only time it would matter is on a circuit. I’m not going race people on the street while doing a school run. On the drag strip or during roll racing it will not matter. I just can’t see it being that big of an issue. I’m not chasing records. I’m building what I love. 

I for one fully approve of "doing what is going to make you love the car afterwards", I discovered JDM drag racing in the late 90s with bootleg VHS etc of Japanese cars with highmount twins having loose as f**k 1/4 mile runs making amazing noises and looking like they're rolling coal so I definitely feel some this. 

I've definitely yarned with mates about it, and approve it if you're understanding and ok with the fact it's not going to work as well as a nicely matched-for-purpose single turbo - I know I personally wouldn't feel like I've built "my car" if I had just another "I'll have the 7685 RB32 auto package deal everyone knows exactly how its going to go and sound deal thanks"... but it's still probably worth having a real solid think about what you should expect and how much it's going to be seem worth it after you've got it going.

I could be completely wrong, but when you say "Even if they don't spool until 5000rpm" it sounds like you're talking about that as a worst case scenario... while I'd guess that to be a best case scenario, or outright optimistic.  A single T67 25G is making solid boost on an RB26 meaningfully after 4000rpm, with twins you'll effectively have two RB16s running these things - but they are feeding a common intake so may not perfectly balance so not even work at the same efficiency of the single version of the same thing.   I'd not be shocked if you're waiting until 6000rpm or more for things to start getting spicy on a loaded dyno run, let alone on the street where the big ol' journal bearing turbos do their best to demonstrate why transient response matters so much when it comes to having an enjoyable car to drive.  The billet comp wheel upgrade is going to do nothing for spool/response.

I suppose the trick here is you're probably looking for "big power" to a degree, and the kit will use Trust's 3-bolt flanges - otherwise there could always be the option of throwing something less garbage on there.   When we'd talked about this kind of thing hypothetically we'd discussed raiding the Kinugawa/Mamba parts catalogue for a Greddy 3-bolt  TD05 turbine housing and TD05-16G6 (or generally something more appropriate than a TD06H-25G) CHRA with 3" inlet comp housing so you have something still capable of up in the 900+hp @ crank territory, still look like a legit high mount twin TD06 kit but actually have a usable power delivery.

These days a custom kit with the likes of a pair of G25-550s or XR4951Ss on small a/r vband housings would be hard to argue with for a 1000hp high mount setup

Edited May 1, 2022 by Lithium

[khezz]

On 1/5/2022 at 12:28 PM, Lithium said:

I for one fully approve of "doing what is going to make you love the car afterwards", I discovered JDM drag racing in the late 90s with bootleg VHS etc of Japanese cars with highmount twins having loose as f**k 1/4 mile runs making amazing noises and looking like they're rolling coal so I definitely feel some this. 

I've definitely yarned with mates about it, and approve it if you're understanding and ok with the fact it's not going to work as well as a nicely matched-for-purpose single turbo - I know I personally wouldn't feel like I've built "my car" if I had just another "I'll have the 7685 RB32 auto package deal everyone knows exactly how its going to go and sound deal thanks"... but it's still probably worth having a real solid think about what you should expect and how much it's going to be seem worth it after you've got it going.

I could be completely wrong, but when you say "Even if they don't spool until 5000rpm" it sounds like you're talking about that as a worst case scenario... while I'd guess that to be a best case scenario, or outright optimistic.  A single T67 25G is making solid boost on an RB26 meaningfully after 4000rpm, with twins you'll effectively have two RB16s running these things - but they are feeding a common intake so may not perfectly balance so not even work at the same efficiency of the single version of the same thing.   I'd not be shocked if you're waiting until 6000rpm or more for things to start getting spicy on a loaded dyno run, let alone on the street where the big ol' journal bearing turbos do their best to demonstrate why transient response matters so much when it comes to having an enjoyable car to drive.  The billet comp wheel upgrade is going to do nothing for spool/response.

I suppose the trick here is you're probably looking for "big power" to a degree, and the kit will use Trust's 3-bolt flanges - otherwise there could always be the option of throwing something less garbage on there.   When we'd talked about this kind of thing hypothetically we'd discussed raiding the Kinugawa/Mamba parts catalogue for a Greddy 3-bolt  TD05 turbine housing and TD05-16G6 (or generally something more appropriate than a TD06H-25G) CHRA with 3" inlet comp housing so you have something still capable of up in the 900+hp @ crank territory, still look like a legit high mount twin TD06 kit but actually have a usable power delivery.

These days a custom kit with the likes of a pair of G25-550s or XR4951Ss on small a/r vband housings would be hard to argue with for a 1000hp high mount setup

I don’t think they will be that bad. I remember t67s being very popular with all the 2L cars. Making 500hp around 6000rpm making them ideal for circuit work for integras, wrxs, evos. 2.5L guys loved them because they made alot of torque from 4000rpm onwards making them ideal for drift.  My friend had one on his r33 gtst. He made 570ish hp on e85. This was about 10 years ago but I dont remember it being laggy. 
 

Now add an engine that’s almost 30% bigger in displacement with higher compression ratio, much better internals and turbos that use better/lighter wheels with better rotating assembly. I think they will be ok. 
 

More lag is better for bearing wear anyways. Right?

[Lithium]

On 01/05/2022 at 10:22 PM, khezz said:

2.5L guys loved them because they made alot of torque from 4000rpm onwards making them ideal for drift.  My friend had one on his r33 gtst. He made 570ish hp on e85. This was about 10 years ago but I dont remember it being laggy. 
 

Now add an engine that’s almost 30% bigger in displacement with higher compression ratio, much better internals and turbos that use better/lighter wheels with better rotating assembly. I think they will be ok. 

Sure, good torque from 4000rpm on a VCT 2.5 litre engine with a SINGLE one of these.   I'm hoping I'm missing something and you aren't assuming that two T67s will spool similar to one?  It REALLY doesn't work that way. 

As I said above, in terms of spool/response - you shouldn't be expecting it to spool like you have a single T67 on a 30% bigger engines, you should be expecting it to behave like you have two engines which are 56% smaller than an RB25 each driving one of these turbos (so a 1.6litre engine), but without the spool benefits of VCT, and I doubt very much the turbine wheel will be any different in design or material over the Trust units and that will be the biggest influence on transient response etc.  

They are going to be way way laggier than a single one on an RB25, absolutely zero doubt about that.   It will drive OK off boost because of sheer torque etc, but it's going to be laggy compared to a 76mm Precision turbo.

 

[khezz]

On 1/5/2022 at 6:34 PM, Lithium said:

Sure, good torque from 4000rpm on a VCT 2.5 litre engine with a SINGLE one of these.   I'm hoping I'm missing something and you aren't assuming that two T67s will spool similar to one?  It REALLY doesn't work that way. 

As I said above, in terms of spool/response - you shouldn't be expecting it to spool like you have a single T67 on a 30% bigger engines, you should be expecting it to behave like you have two engines which are 56% smaller than an RB25 each driving one of these turbos (so a 1.6litre engine), but without the spool benefits of VCT, and I doubt very much the turbine wheel will be any different in design or material over the Trust units and that will be the biggest influence on transient response etc.  

They are going to be way way laggier than a single one on an RB25, absolutely zero doubt about that.   It will drive OK off boost because of sheer torque etc, but it's going to be laggy compared to a 76mm Precision turbo.

 

You are so negative. Yes, it will spool up later then a 7685 but you don’t run an 8.7 in a full bodied R32 with turbos that don’t spool. 
 

if I get disappointed, I can always go back. It’s not like there is a lack of choice when it comes to big modern singles. But old school big twins in good nick do not come up very often at all. 

[Kinkstaah]

They don't come up often in good nick because, well, they're bad, man...

At some point old school is just old.

[The Bogan]

On 01/05/2022 at 10:19 PM, Kinkstaah said:

They don't come up often in good nick because, well, they're bad, man...

At some point old school is just old.

TO4Z for eva

[khezz]

On 1/5/2022 at 8:30 PM, mlr said:

TO4Z for eva

Ooooooohhh twin TO4Zs

[Ben C34]

2 big turbos, 2 big bottles of nitrous. Done.

 

[Butters]

I can't remember exactly what ant man had on his skyline it may have been twin t04z , made big power numbers, near 1000 in the days before that was a thing. Didn't boost until near 7000rpm though.   Cool as hell to see.